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Old 10-24-2021, 10:53 PM   #1
lookingfornewadventure
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Horrible First Time Out

Hi

Took our first trip in our new to us fifth wheel and had one problem after another. We had the thing independently inspected before we bought, so I can only imagine user error…

First, the previous owners had installed a plumbing loop of some kind hooking up city water and black tank flush to single hose, with a valve. I hooked up water, could not figure out what the strange cycling sound was, and low and behold water started pouring out of the toilet after a while. Sewer wasn’t hooked up yet, I noticed black tank sensor was full, so I ran to hook up and drain it. Thank god there was nothing “dirty” in there yet. First lesson learned, the little valve on the plumbing loop is REALLY important…. Should also add that they installed the LCI waste master sewer connections, if that matters.

Next I ran a load of towels in newly installed washer (dealer did it), made sure both grey tanks were open (dealer told us there was only one grey flush valve but thanks to this forum I knew better, thank you!) and in the spin cycle, water came pouring out into the carpeted bedroom, and all around the hitch outside. Mopped up that mess, bought a dehumidifier, and tried to turn on the furnace. After blowing for 30 seconds or so, it turns off. No sound of ignition outside. Stove works, gas is running. Then I tried to take a shower and the water isn’t draining from the shower pan at all. Sensors say tanks are empty, and I checked that kitchen sink is draining, and bathroom sink is draining.

We are at our wits end, are we overlooking something? Wondering if we bought a lemon, if there is more creative plumbing somewhere, etc…. Any and all suggestions are appreciated. We are dirty and cold! ��. Oh, yeah, 2018 3121. Thanks!
 
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Old 10-24-2021, 11:11 PM   #2
AZ Traveler
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Shauna,

Sorry you had these problems. Don't think you have a lemon after your first trip but you certainly did not get good instruction on your rig.

-Sounds like you hepvo valve in the shower is plugged. Do not try to unplug it by running anything through it. This thread can help: https://www.montanaowners.com/forums...ad.php?t=80569

-Remove your add on that connects the black flush with your fresh water. You don't want those connected in any way which might contaminate your fresh water.

-No clue what your washer issue is

-There is a troubleshooting guide for the furnace here on the forum. https://www.montanaowners.com/forums/downloads.php Did you run it before buying the rig?

Hang in there it should get better.
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Old 10-25-2021, 05:11 AM   #3
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Man that sure was not a good time, your washer waste line also has a hepvo valve which will be in your basement. This also could be your issue, is this water connection in your convenience center ?

Don’t trust those sensors as they are not reliable, we always keep our valve open when running the washer.
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Old 10-25-2021, 07:16 AM   #4
Dave W
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I no longer trust 'independent' inspectors after just having our home pre inspected for possible spring sale. There are faults on our 50) year old house that I know of that are on my list to fix he never looked at. This may be the case wit your inspector. e looked at the normal RV areas of concern - water leaks, roof condition, tires and flipped a few switches and declared it good to go. What he didn't do is "live" in it with all systems as they would be at an RV park.

As far as tank sensors - they are for the most part, especially in the black tank, a waste of time as they start to crud up at the first use and only get worse. All they are is a 1/4" diameter electrical contact extending less then 1/4" in the tank . They measures differential voltage between two. Tank slime on the sides render them useless. There are products like SeeLevel that work(Valterra) horst Miracle sensors are no better then the originals

That plumbing loop - not much to say about that except talk to your dealer about returning it the original configuration..

Good luck. This is normally a very nice unit you can be happy owning
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Old 10-25-2021, 07:52 AM   #5
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Welcome to the forum and sorry about your first time experience. Kind of odd, the sales place didn't catch the plumbing issue the original owner did. I hope that after these plumbing issues are sorted out, you'll have enjoyment out of your trailer. Keep us posted.
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Old 10-25-2021, 08:50 AM   #6
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cOol it

Quote:
Originally Posted by 432bartman View Post
Welcome to the forum and sorry about your first time experience. Kind of odd, the sales place didn't catch the plumbing issue the original owner did. I hope that after these plumbing issues are sorted out, you'll have enjoyment out of your trailer. Keep us posted.
To lessen the stress of trying to figure out what the heck is going on just hire an independant RV REPAIRE guy (not an inspector not the dealer) to sort things out for you after explaining to him what`s going on. Pervious owner modifications sometimes can only be understood by the person who did them and don`t follow any known logic. He will be more likely to give you the real scoop on the whys and what fors and advise you on how to use your camper. JUst pay him and forget it lifes to short to worry about this stuff.
Better get a few cheap box fans from Walmart and blow them on the wet carpet WITH the dehumidifier if you get mold started then you in trouble.
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Old 10-25-2021, 10:38 AM   #7
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Just an FYI: I have a stackable Splendid washer and dryer in my Montana. When it was first installed, I completely empties the grey tank .. completely. I then left the outside slide valve open and put a bucket under the drain. We than ran the washing machine through it's complete cycle (the shortest) and caught the water in a bucket that I knew exactly what size it was.

Bottom line: The washing machine took 8 gallons of water. Keeping track of our water usage I have never run the washing machine with the outside grey tank valves open. Also, I dump the black tank first, then I can use the laundry water/shower water/bathroom sink water and back-flush it into the black tank to help rinse it out better.

So, just an FYI, your Splendid washer uses about 8 gallons of water.
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Old 10-25-2021, 08:16 PM   #8
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Thank you all for your replies and ideas! We had a service tech guy come and fix it all. Sail switch had gone bad on the furnace, the washing machine’s hepvo valve had been installed with the inner membrane pointing the wrong way, and the shower’s hepvo valve needed a jiggling and bit of cleaning to get it to start draining. As for the plumbing loop, the tech said it was actually done very well with backflow prevention, water regulator, etc. Not sure we will keep it that way anyway, but it sure is nice to have everything working as it should! I really appreciate this forum, I hope to be able to help someone else some day. (You know, when I actually know something!) Got everything all dried up and warm, and ourselves clean. Worth every penny.

Now to replace that torture rack they call a mattress…..��. I appreciate all the threads here of mattress recommendations too!
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Old 10-26-2021, 09:00 AM   #9
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I have a Montana 3781RL and sometimes after changing propane bottles, I have some issues with the furnace. If you try to ignite the furnace a few times, there is a safety so you don't blow the camper up. Before replacing components, try pulling the Furnace panel and look for the Rocker Switch on the blower motor. For me, I can switch this off for about a minute, turn it back on and this resets things. Try the furnace again, if that didn't fix it, could be the air flow switch.
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Old 10-26-2021, 10:09 AM   #10
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Solution on your mattress! Whatever make or brand you use in your house, it will work just as nice in your camper. Starting with that make or brand on your bed in the house, price it out, and then move forward from there. (That is .... if you are happy with the mattress on your bed at home!)

Happy Camping! Glad all your woe's are no more!
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Old 10-26-2021, 10:54 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lookingfornewadventure View Post
Thank you all for your replies and ideas! We had a service tech guy come and fix it all. Sail switch had gone bad on the furnace, the washing machine’s hepvo valve had been installed with the inner membrane pointing the wrong way, and the shower’s hepvo valve needed a jiggling and bit of cleaning to get it to start draining. As for the plumbing loop, the tech said it was actually done very well with backflow prevention, water regulator, etc. Not sure we will keep it that way anyway, but it sure is nice to have everything working as it should! I really appreciate this forum, I hope to be able to help someone else some day. (You know, when I actually know something!) Got everything all dried up and warm, and ourselves clean. Worth every penny.

Now to replace that torture rack they call a mattress…..��. I appreciate all the threads here of mattress recommendations too!
We ended up putting a foam topper on the king size mattress, like we have at home and sleep really well. Everybody's back are different, and this is coming from me with a double lower back fusion and one disc in my neck fused.
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Old 10-26-2021, 04:50 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lookingfornewadventure View Post
Thank you all for your replies and ideas! We had a service tech guy come and fix it all. Sail switch had gone bad on the furnace, the washing machine’s hepvo valve had been installed with the inner membrane pointing the wrong way, and the shower’s hepvo valve needed a jiggling and bit of cleaning to get it to start draining. As for the plumbing loop, the tech said it was actually done very well with backflow prevention, water regulator, etc. Not sure we will keep it that way anyway, but it sure is nice to have everything working as it should! I really appreciate this forum, I hope to be able to help someone else some day. (You know, when I actually know something!) Got everything all dried up and warm, and ourselves clean. Worth every penny.

Now to replace that torture rack they call a mattress…..��. I appreciate all the threads here of mattress recommendations too!
Glad to hear you got it all fixed
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Old 10-27-2021, 04:55 AM   #13
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When we bought our first used trailer, the first time we used it was in our driveway. We found out what previous owners had done to this trailer and how to work around them or to correct them. It was a great learning experience for us and didn't ruin a weekend trip. You might want to keep this in mind for your next camping trip.
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Old 10-27-2021, 09:31 AM   #14
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Driveway camping is a great idea, but our HOA strictly forbids it. We live on a steep hill anyway, not sure how we could have got the thing level!
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Old 10-27-2021, 10:17 AM   #15
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Glad its all fixed.........time to camp.
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Old 10-31-2021, 02:19 PM   #16
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shake down cruse

One thing I learned in the Navy, is do a shake down cruse. Go to local campground with full hookups and test everything. It will save you in the long run. My rig has been sitting for a year, I will take it a few miles down the road and test everything. Frig, water systems, electrical, slides, dump tanks. If I need to fix something, I will know where to find it. I will save you a lot of grief. With a used rig, it is hard to tell what the last person did. Good luck
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Old 10-31-2021, 02:25 PM   #17
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Glad things are on a positive trend. Best of luck going forward.
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Old 10-31-2021, 02:40 PM   #18
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Welcome to RVing, lol. I have had, hepvo and sail switch issues, easy fix, and several others. The guys on this board are just fantastic as a resource, congratulations and happy camping.
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Old 10-31-2021, 03:06 PM   #19
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Ouch!!

Suggest taking it back to the dealer to address your concerns and inspect all the plumbing.
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Old 10-31-2021, 05:24 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lookingfornewadventure View Post
Hi

Took our first trip in our new to us fifth wheel and had one problem after another. We had the thing independently inspected before we bought, so I can only imagine user error…

First, the previous owners had installed a plumbing loop of some kind hooking up city water and black tank flush to single hose, with a valve. I hooked up water, could not figure out what the strange cycling sound was, and low and behold water started pouring out of the toilet after a while. Sewer wasn’t hooked up yet, I noticed black tank sensor was full, so I ran to hook up and drain it. Thank god there was nothing “dirty” in there yet. First lesson learned, the little valve on the plumbing loop is REALLY important…. Should also add that they installed the LCI waste master sewer connections, if that matters.

Next I ran a load of towels in newly installed washer (dealer did it), made sure both grey tanks were open (dealer told us there was only one grey flush valve but thanks to this forum I knew better, thank you!) and in the spin cycle, water came pouring out into the carpeted bedroom, and all around the hitch outside. Mopped up that mess, bought a dehumidifier, and tried to turn on the furnace. After blowing for 30 seconds or so, it turns off. No sound of ignition outside. Stove works, gas is running. Then I tried to take a shower and the water isn’t draining from the shower pan at all. Sensors say tanks are empty, and I checked that kitchen sink is draining, and bathroom sink is draining.

We are at our wits end, are we overlooking something? Wondering if we bought a lemon, if there is more creative plumbing somewhere, etc…. Any and all suggestions are appreciated. We are dirty and cold! ��. Oh, yeah, 2018 3121. Thanks!
On that hose to the black flush I have installed a mechanical water timer. Otherwise I would have flooded the place long ago.
If he bought a wastemaster, what's the odds he also installed the electric valves from the same people? It does sound like all the grey valves are closed or blocked, not impossible but unlikely. If you don't see any unexplained switches (I can provide pictures if needed) then he probably didn't install the electric valves but it sure sounds like he did.
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