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Old 10-20-2020, 09:12 AM   #1
eZAK
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Fresh water system?

We have just finished our second weekend trip in our new HC.

What we did on both trips pertaining to the fresh water;
1) Put about ten gallons in, through water inlet, for flushing.
2) At campground I filled tank until it came out vent in rear.
3) Used water sparingly, dishes, toilet, one quick rinse shower each.

We ended up running out of water both weekends!
4 days 3 nights. We were unable to do breakfast dishes on the last day.

In our Titanium, w/ 63gal. fresh, we could easily go 5 or 6 days!

294RL claims to have a 66gal tank

Also, The pump is way too loud! Where is it located? and How can I quite it down?
Then there is the problem of adding a freshener or sanitizer.
I tried to add it through the vent in the rear with a funnel. The solution or even water would NOT drain into tank Unless under pressure!

Could this vent be the problem? Maybe plumbed wrong

Anyways let me know what you think
 
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Old 10-20-2020, 11:26 AM   #2
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"Then there is the problem of adding a freshener or sanitizer.
I tried to add it through the vent in the rear with a funnel. The solution or even water would NOT drain into tank Unless under pressure!"

Your Montana does not have a gravity fill port. In order to fill your water tank, you attach a garden hose to the fresh water in-let, flip the valve and fill the tank. If you flip the valve the other way, you can run water directly from the garden hose and nothing goes into the fresh water tank.

There is another valve in your wet bay for winterizing. What you do is, prepare your sanitizing solution in a bucket and then use your winterizing system to run the sanitized water through all your pipes.... exactly like you would do if you winterized with pink-stuff.

In order to get the sanatizing solution into your fresh water tank, you attach your outside shower (that blue coiled hose) from the faucet to the fill port and flip that valve to fill the fresh water tank (same as if you were filling from a garden hose).

You now flip on your water pump. It pick-up the sanitizing solution from the bucket, flows through the water lines, comes out the shower (blue coiled hose) and into the city water fill and into your fresh water tank.

It sounds like a lot, but it really is very, very easy to do. It's exactly the same thing as winterizing with pink-stuff, with the addition of using the outside blue coiled hose to add the sanitizer to the fresh water tank.

Easy peasy.

Another tip, if you ever find yourself with no hot water, say or example the water heater failed for whatever reason; you can always heat water on the propane stove, and then pump it through your winterizing system. I actually did this once so we could take warm showers. I put the water heater in by-pass first, and the hot water pumped directly to the inside shower. By the time the water passed through all the pipes, it was cool enough to take a very comfortable.... very very quick Navy shower. You are limited only to the size of your container that hold the water. Tuck this idea away for a future emergency and hope you never have to do it.
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Old 10-20-2020, 11:43 AM   #3
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Another tip. We camp at Indiana State Parks, and there are only a few few parks that have water on site, and even fewer with full hook-up. So, in the past (3 travel trailers and now a Fifth Wheel), we always tried to reserve a campsite that was within 200 feet of the common water spigot so I could stretch a garden hose from the faucet to the trailer and fill the fresh water tank whenever it ran low.

Fast forward when an idea hit me. We now carry a 35 gallon water tank, purchased from TSC (Tractor Supply Company) and a water transfer pump that runs on 120 v - AC power. But we also have an inverter we carry in the truck, so the transfer can be powered via the truck battery.

I can now take the tank anywhere and fill with water and bring it back to the camper, anywhere it is parked, and pump it into the fresh water tank, any time, and now ... not limited to just 200 feet from a water spigot source. Of course, you also have to have a way to dump your tanks also, so we also always have a Blue Tote to make trips to the dump station.

After a few trips out, you'll finally have an eye and a good feel on your water usage, when you need to fill and when you need to dump. And yes, RV ownership means water management!

My previous trailer (no photo doing this with with my current 5er) ...






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Old 10-20-2020, 01:49 PM   #4
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We do a fare amount of state park camping also. Like you said most do not have water at the site. Almost none have sewer. I always bring our 42 gallon blue tank if staying over 5 days or so.

With that being said, we just returned from a 15 day (all no hook ups) state park trip. At day 7 is was time to dump and refill water. Using the blue tank is not a big deal, but refilling water is. Used to do it 10 gallons at a time.

This trip I said f-that. Pulled the slides in, hooked up, raised the level up. Went to the dump station and filled fresh water and dumped tanks. From the time I left the site I was back at site and set back up in less then 20 min.

Moral of the story is, if I know we are going to be in an easy in out site, I will leave the blue tank and fresh water containers at home and just hook up and go dump and refill at the dump station. Its just too easy.
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Old 10-20-2020, 03:11 PM   #5
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Also, The pump is way too loud! Where is it located? and How can I quite it down? Pump is behind the convenience center. Search the forum - you can buy a quieter pump and isolate it better.

Then there is the problem of adding a freshener or sanitizer.
I fill my hose with bleach and then hook it up to fill the tank.
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Old 10-20-2020, 04:08 PM   #6
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Many of us use a 45 gallon water bladder combined with a 12V pump to re-fill the water tank. The bladder folds up into a small package when not in use. The 12V pump wired to a Bargman 7 pin plug allows you to use the RV plug on the truck as a power source

Water Bladder
12V DC Water Pump
Bargman Style 7 Pin Plug
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Old 10-20-2020, 04:52 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl n Susan View Post
Many of us use a 45 gallon water bladder combined with a 12V pump to re-fill the water tank. The bladder folds up into a small package when not in use. The 12V pump wired to a Bargman 7 pin plug allows you to use the RV plug on the truck as a power source

Water Bladder
12V DC Water Pump
Bargman Style 7 Pin Plug
Thought about the water bladder. But I don't like the idea not being able to dry the inside of it out having that water sit in their growing God knows what.
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Old 10-20-2020, 07:37 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beeje View Post
Thought about the water bladder. But I don't like the idea not being able to dry the inside of it out having that water sit in their growing God knows what.
Just like the water tank on a camper, the plastic tanks, jugs, containers, and bladders all need to sanitized ever now and then too. I do my 35 gallon tank in the Spring, same time I do my trailer tank after de-winterizing. Never an issue with anything growing in it.
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Old 10-20-2020, 08:04 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eZAK View Post
We have just finished our second weekend trip in our new HC.

What we did on both trips pertaining to the fresh water;
1) Put about ten gallons in, through water inlet, for flushing.
2) At campground I filled tank until it came out vent in rear.
3) Used water sparingly, dishes, toilet, one quick rinse shower each.

We ended up running out of water both weekends!
4 days 3 nights. We were unable to do breakfast dishes on the last day.

In our Titanium, w/ 63gal. fresh, we could easily go 5 or 6 days!

294RL claims to have a 66gal tank

Also, The pump is way too loud! Where is it located? and How can I quite it down?
Then there is the problem of adding a freshener or sanitizer.
I tried to add it through the vent in the rear with a funnel. The solution or even water would NOT drain into tank Unless under pressure!

Could this vent be the problem? Maybe plumbed wrong

Anyways let me know what you think
Hi,

I think I read somewhere that the 12gal Waterheater is calculated in the 66gal.
So you have actually 54gal freshwater.
Not sure but maybe others can confirm.

We have similar capacity and can do 3-4 days when we are smart with dishes and galley water.

Mike
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Old 10-20-2020, 08:12 PM   #10
beeje
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suny07 View Post
Hi,

I think I read somewhere that the 12gal Waterheater is calculated in the 66gal.
So you have actually 54gal freshwater.
Not sure but maybe others can confirm.

We have similar capacity and can do 3-4 days when we are smart with dishes and galley water.

Mike
The fresh water tank is 50 gallons. 12 gallons for the water heater and the rest in the lines themselves. It's kind of misleading.
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Old 10-20-2020, 08:32 PM   #11
Daryles
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As far as noisy water pump....
Search on
Quiet water pump
Many threads on how to do it.
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Old 10-22-2020, 08:48 AM   #12
eZAK
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Originally Posted by AZ Traveler View Post
Also, The pump is way too loud! Where is it located? and How can I quite it down? Pump is behind the convenience center. Search the forum - you can buy a quieter pump and isolate it better.

Then there is the problem of adding a freshener or sanitizer.
I fill my hose with bleach and then hook it up to fill the tank.
How much bleach do you use?
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Old 10-22-2020, 08:56 AM   #13
eZAK
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl n Susan View Post
Many of us use a 45 gallon water bladder combined with a 12V pump to re-fill the water tank. The bladder folds up into a small package when not in use. The 12V pump wired to a Bargman 7 pin plug allows you to use the RV plug on the truck as a power source
Interesting!
I wonder if a bladder type del could be used under a slide out awning?
This could prop up the awning and use gravity to feed
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Old 10-22-2020, 09:15 AM   #14
eZAK
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suny07 View Post
Hi,

I think I read somewhere that the 12gal Waterheater is calculated in the 66gal.
So you have actually 54gal freshwater.
Not sure but maybe others can confirm.

We have similar capacity and can do 3-4 days when we are smart with dishes and galley water.

Mike
Not that your wrong Mike, But
Wow, I sure hope that statement is wrong.
All the information I was able to attain states
"Total Fresh Water Tank Capacity" ** Gal. (with HC 294RL being 66)
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Old 10-22-2020, 09:39 AM   #15
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Why couldn't you use blue tote for dumping on the way out and then water on the way back??
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Old 10-22-2020, 09:45 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eZAK View Post
Not that your wrong Mike, But
Wow, I sure hope that statement is wrong.
All the information I was able to attain states
"Total Fresh Water Tank Capacity" ** Gal. (with HC 294RL being 66)
I am 100% certain he is correct. I have been under my unit with all of the coroplast covering off and there's a part number on my freshwater tank. I Googled it and it's a 50 gallon tank with a stated 66 gallon capacity from Keystone. So that 66 gallon definitely includes the water heater and any water in the lines
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Old 10-22-2020, 09:55 AM   #17
eZAK
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In the early days with our TT's we always carried a dump tote and a 10 gal. container for fresh.

We we started with the Titanium we no longer needed the dump tote
(max. stay was 9 nights) We did however need to use a fresh water tote (new 6gal.) after roughly 135hrs. (5.5days) (apprx. 11 gal. per day)

Now, IF we assume that the specs on the water tank are fabricated, and we only have 50 gals. available, Then for 72hrs. (3 full days) We should have only used about 33gals.
[Given the previous scenario]

In doing the math however;
In approx. 65 hrs. (2.7days) Indicator light shows 'Empty' and pump runs continuously. It suggest that we used 18.5 gal. per day.

Something is not right here. We conserve water the same way we always did. We don't drink any water from the tank (bottled water only).

I plan on investigating this matter further.

Thanks everyone!
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Old 10-22-2020, 10:12 AM   #18
eZAK
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Originally Posted by beeje View Post
I am 100% certain he is correct. I have been under my unit with all of the coroplast covering off and there's a part number on my freshwater tank. I Googled it and it's a 50 gallon tank with a stated 66 gallon capacity from Keystone. So that 66 gallon definitely includes the water heater and any water in the lines
So, That would mean that Keystone has mispresented their product and
mislead their consumer!

I, for one, would like to hear from Keystone on this.
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Old 10-22-2020, 10:13 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eZAK View Post
In the early days with our TT's we always carried a dump tote and a 10 gal. container for fresh.

We we started with the Titanium we no longer needed the dump tote
(max. stay was 9 nights) We did however need to use a fresh water tote (new 6gal.) after roughly 135hrs. (5.5days) (apprx. 11 gal. per day)

Now, IF we assume that the specs on the water tank are fabricated, and we only have 50 gals. available, Then for 72hrs. (3 full days) We should have only used about 33gals.
[Given the previous scenario]

In doing the math however;
In approx. 65 hrs. (2.7days) Indicator light shows 'Empty' and pump runs continuously. It suggest that we used 18.5 gal. per day.

Something is not right here. We conserve water the same way we always did. We don't drink any water from the tank (bottled water only).

I plan on investigating this matter further.

Thanks everyone!
Don't know what you're year model you have. Create a signature so other members can see that. Or maybe that's just my cell phone and it doesn't show up I'm not sure.
I guess it's possible they changed something with the newer units but I seriously doubt it since the capacities are all stated the same as the older units.
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Old 10-25-2020, 09:25 AM   #20
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Just a thought on your water usage. It could be the style of faucets and shower head. We recently replaced our kitchen faucet and there was a note stating with the faucet stating it will use more water than the older style due to a higher flow rate.
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