Toilet paper.... i just have to say this

[ForBruce]

I know i started another thread about WHICH PAPER DO YOU USE.

but this a somewhat of a warning....

I was testing out different papers and to my dismay. One of the worst and potentially dangerous to use is the one made by a toilet manufacturer.

Both my wife and i reached the same conclusion separately .

The THETFORD toilet paper STICKS to the bowl ..unless EXCESSIVELY wet.

Which means it can jam in the bowl valve or get stuck in the pipe on the way down. Might be a good dissolving paper when submerged , but when partially wet it has been sticking to the sides.

AS a side note the CAMCO 2-layer is not FINGER resistant. and quite thin even though they bill it as a 2 ply. (took 3 pack back to walmart)

so fat the Scotts RV seems to work the best and does not STICK to the bowl.

May the Flush Be With You

[DQDick]

Over ten years of full timing and it's Scotts RV tissue for us. When you find something that works for you, in that area, you don't mess with it.

[MARK A]

Kirkland here. Dissolves well and no breakthroughs!


Mark

[Cat320]

Use lots of water when flushing, that's the key.

[ForBruce]

Originally Posted by Cat320

Use lots of water when flushing, that's the key.

water is not the key....excessive water use = excessive dumping.

the point i was trying to bring out is that the Thetford paper is quick dissolving...actually too quick as the glue making the paper dissolves instantly leaving a slight film on the walls of the toilet causing the paper to catch ..UNLESS YOU FLOOD the bowl

have noticed that after a normal flush..one in a while we see paper on the bowl walls...what happens in the pipe on the way down especially if there are curves in the line is anyone's guess let alone a buildup of Thetford glue on the bottom of the black tank itself.

yes loads of water will flush the paper down but in the tank as the water paper and glue separate ... WILL THE GLUE SETTLE TO THE BOTTOM and eventually cause a buildup of muck.

I used to think of how many girls i could do ,then how much money i could make...and now all that is left is Bowel movements and toilet paper...SIGH

[rohrmann]

Actually, no glue is used in the making of toilet paper, and it's unlikely that you will have a buildup of toilet paper on the bottom of the black tank if you are using enough water, which is the key to having a functioning black tank that will drain properly. We have used Scotts 1000, which isn't an RV toilet paper, for years and have not had any issues, and for the two of us, we can use the toilet normally in excess of a week between draining and have gone closer to ten days or more when dry camping. Everyone finds what works for them, but I have been using TankTechsRX for a long time, and this aids in eliminating odors and helps with successful draining.

[mtlakejim]

[QUOTE=ForBruce;1200204]water is not the key....excessive water use = excessive dumping.


Yes plenty of water IS the key to keeping your septic system functioning (says 99% of those who actually know what they are talking about)! Toilet paper is NOT the only solids that will be in that tank. You need the mix in the tank to be fairly fluid to freely flow out of the tank. No way that will happen without enough water mixed with it!!! MOST full timers will only dump the tank about once per week with two people using the system even using a significant volume of water with each flush. If you have to do it more than that, may I suggest that you lay off the beer and Mexican food for a while...…


Also agree with others that there is no glue used to make toilet paper. Your just seeing pulp residue if anything. With PLENTY OF WATER that residue will flow out of the tank with the rest of the solids.

[PSFORD99]

[QUOTE=mtlakejim;1200215]

Originally Posted by ForBruce

water is not the key....excessive water use = excessive dumping.


Yes plenty of water IS the key to keeping your septic system functioning (says 99% of those who actually know what they are talking about)! Toilet paper is NOT the only solids that will be in that tank. You need the mix in the tank to be fairly fluid to freely flow out of the tank. No way that will happen without enough water mixed with it!!! MOST full timers will only dump the tank about once per week with two people using the system even using a significant volume of water with each flush. If you have to do it more than that, may I suggest that you lay off the beer and Mexican food for a while...…


Also agree with others that there is no glue used to make toilet paper. Your just seeing pulp residue if anything. With PLENTY OF WATER that residue will flow out of the tank with the rest of the solids.

The key, yes plenty of water .I've seen some concerned on the other thread a week or so ago about the toilet paper messing up the sensors. I have never yet had a fifth wheel ,this one is our fourth that those sensors worked very well on the black or grey tanks not accurate at all, nor have I cared especially the black tank.

For years now I have relied on getting that air bubble when flushing, thats a signal that that black tank is nearly full, I never even look at the sensor readings .As far as they grey I usually let a bit out evert two -three days , so they never get full, and when I do the black tank I always have some in the grey to flush thing a bit . Having that black tank full, and using plenty of water is the secret to keeping it working well.

[WeBeFulltime]

Originally Posted by ForBruce

water is not the key....excessive water use = excessive dumping.

the point i was trying to bring out is that the Thetford paper is quick dissolving...actually too quick as the glue making the paper dissolves instantly leaving a slight film on the walls of the toilet causing the paper to catch ..UNLESS YOU FLOOD the bowl

have noticed that after a normal flush..one in a while we see paper on the bowl walls...what happens in the pipe on the way down especially if there are curves in the line is anyone's guess let alone a buildup of Thetford glue on the bottom of the black tank itself.

yes loads of water will flush the paper down but in the tank as the water paper and glue separate ... WILL THE GLUE SETTLE TO THE BOTTOM and eventually cause a buildup of muck.

I used to think of how many girls i could do ,then how much money i could make...and now all that is left is Bowel movements and toilet paper...SIGH

Sorry but you're WRONG. Full-timed 9+ years using any paper we wanted to with adequate amount of water and never a problem and NEVER used the so called RV TP.

[PSFORD99]

Originally Posted by WeBeFulltime

Sorry but you're WRONG. Full-timed 9+ years using any paper we wanted to with adequate amount of water and never a problem and NEVER used the so called RV TP.

Sure hard to convince some on here , that adequate amount of water is key. Especially the ones using the garbage can method

[BB_TX]

Originally Posted by rohrmann

Actually, no glue is used in the making of toilet paper, and it's unlikely that you will have a buildup of toilet paper on the bottom of the black tank if you are using enough water, which is the key to having a functioning black tank that will drain properly. .......

Agree with no glue. The wood fibers that end up as paper are actually held together by the small amount of remaining natural polymers of the wood that remain after the breakdown processing takes place. The strength of the paper, and how fast it dissolves, probably has to do with how much of the polymers remain for the different brands.

Learned a little about the paper process while designing safety control systems for power plants, including paper mills. Including how dangerous that process can be!

[jsb5717]

Ditto on the "plenty of water" thing. That's the ticket. With a nearly 50 gallon black tank we have never filled it up with the 2 of us and grand kids in and out. I like to start out with 5-7 gallons in the tank. We use the TST powder packets which also seem to work well. At the end of the trip I will sometimes use a bucket and add another 5-7 gallons to ensure a good flush.

Last trip I left home with about 7-8 gallons of water and some liquid dial dish soap to let it slosh around to help keep the sensors clean...worked well.

We use the cheap Walmart Septic Safe TP with good success. Totally agree that you don't want a TP that falls apart before you're done using it.

Everyone's got to go and everyone's got to dump their tanks...just a pleasant fact of RVing. Some things I've learned over years of experience and others from forums just like this.

[twindman]

I think the key point here is "What is plenty of water?". Perhaps we just each visualize it differently. Like one idea - half a gallon per flush. Or another idea - enough to flush everything down but no more.

[DutchmenSport]

Well, Mr. Bidet man is back, adding my 2 cents worth again.....



Everyone has to remember that different models of camper have different sizes of holding tanks too. Someone with a 60 gallon black tank can go much longer between dumps than someone with a 35 gallon tank. When boondocking, one person may be equipped to go for 2 weeks at a time because they have larger tanks. Someone else may be able to go only 2 days because of smaller tanks.

With that said, if your camper has smaller tanks, then water management is paramount. It's just as critical as power management when you have a 50 amp camper plugged into a 30 amp outlet. It's all about management. And everyone does it different.

Again, with that said, water management is critical, especially when boondocking, and especially with smaller tanks. In that case, it certainly is most important to minimize the amount of water going into the black tank to flush paper.

If you have a black tank outlet and a grey tank outlet merging into one single outlet, then you are in a good position to use back flushing. Attach a 3rd valve, like a Flush King and after dumping the black tank, close off the 3rd valve and open the grey valve and let it "backflush" into the black tank. Close off the grey, and open the Flush King again.

No matter how much or how little water was originally in the black tank, the back flush will 2 a few things for you, especially if you boomdock.

First, recycling a purpose the grey water.
Second, your black tank does not have to be completely full, or even half full when you dump. The back flush WILL pull more out, even if you have a completely full tank initially. You'll be amazed how much more come out of the black when you back flush, even if it WAS originally full.

Third, you do not have to use a boat load of water when you flush your toilet. Thus saving water (water management), and the grey will flow more into the black tank to rinse it out. It's a win-win situation for everyone when you backflush.

The only draw back is, you do have to take a shower every now and then to get water in the grey tank. When boomdocking, I would not be surprised if folks takes outside showers so the grey tank does not fill up.

Regardless of toilet paper usage or not, back flushing works and pulls "stuff" out of your tank you had no idea still remained. So if water is limited, this is one way to do the most to keep the tank rinsed out well.

Often times, when we do dishes in the kitchen sink, we use a tub in the sink and keep the dish water and dump that down the toilet to add more water. And sometimes I dump it down the shower to add more water to the shower tank so there is more water to back flush. It's a balancing act to make sure you have enough water in the grey tank to back flush into the black tank. But once you figure it out, it's a great way to conserve water, and no need for tons water to flush a single sheet of toilet paper.

We camp at Indiana State Parks primarily. And most campgrounds in Indiana do not have full hook-up. So I use a Blue Tote to hall my "stuff" to the dump station. For us, dumping is every 2 days, and I back flush the shower water to the toilet water. Why every 2 days? Because my blue tote is 32 gallons. And in 2 days, we average a bit under 32 gallons between black tank, shower tank, and kitchen tank, and the Blue Tote does not over spill!

Back Flushing works..

And oh another comment.

PSFORD99 said, "Sure hard to convince some on here , that adequate amount of water is key. Especially the ones using the garbage can method."

I will say the same thing about Bidets. Use a Bidet and you won't have to haggle over toilet paper any more, and you automatically use "plenty" of water.

[mtlakejim]

I'm not into Boondocking. BUT if I was, I would make sure I had LARGE tanks on my rig or have a portable tank to take off the waste. Granted a Bidet may help reduce the paper used BUT let me remind everyone again that paper is NOT the only thing going into the holding tank!!! Backflushing (If your setup for it) may also help but NOTHING and I do mean NOTHING works as well has having plenty of water in the tank with the solids to start with!!


Since our gray water and black water systems are totally separated, I use a wand down the toilet every now and then. It isn't fun but gets the job done. But then I have the luxury of a dump station connection at my house.


As for emptying tanks, like others I wait for the burp or bubble and find the sensors totally useless on all but the freshwater tank. IF I am camping with water but no sewer hookup (which is common at our local COE parks) I will fill up the black tank with water on purpose before we go to the dump station.

[PSFORD99]

Originally Posted by mtlakejim

I'm not into Boondocking. BUT if I was, I would make sure I had LARGE tanks on my rig or have a portable tank to take off the waste. Granted a Bidet may help reduce the paper used BUT let me remind everyone again that paper is NOT the only thing going into the holding tank!!! Backflushing (If your setup for it) may also help but NOTHING and I do mean NOTHING works as well has having plenty of water in the tank with the solids to start with!!


Since our gray water and black water systems are totally separated, I use a wand down the toilet every now and then. It isn't fun but gets the job done. But then I have the luxury of a dump station connection at my house.


As for emptying tanks, like others I wait for the burp or bubble and find the sensors totally useless on all but the freshwater tank. IF I am camping with water but no sewer hookup (which is common at our local COE parks) I will fill up the black tank with water on purpose before we go to the dump station.

I am sure there are many on here that have been at this longer then me , but after having a fifth wheel for the past 15 years ,this is our fourth one,I agree as said ,plenty of water is the secret to eliminating problems with the black tank.

I have the flush system on the last two fifth wheels ,and I use that religiously , but 95% of the time I am on full hookups. We have a five day hunting trip planned this coming week.I will fill the water tank, we will be fairly conservative with that, but having the experience we have with everything else, we will will be fine. We will use the black tank as we always do, and in those five days there will be no problem with capacity. No bidets, no toilet paper in the garbage cans etc etc etc. We will use the black tank as it was intended .

[phillyg]

Originally Posted by twindman

I think the key point here is "What is plenty of water?". Perhaps we just each visualize it differently. Like one idea - half a gallon per flush. Or another idea - enough to flush everything down but no more.

My solution is to flush as much as you need to clean the bowl, then do it again for the same amount of time.

[twindman]

That is kind of what I do too. But I installed a new toilet with a sprayer a couple of years ago. That sprayer comes in mighty handy!!!

[Mikelff]

If you use a microbiological holding tank treatment in your black tank you will not need excessive water to flush. That microbiologic treatment will break down almost any paper and solids. I have used regular household toilet paper in an emergency, and to my surprise, that treatment broke it down to nothing! So my point is if you use a microbiologic black tank treatment, and use a toilet paper labeled safe for septic systems, you will not have any issues. The microbes keep your tank walls and sensors clean and never any stink. The debate over the TP becomes mute and an exercise in futility. Do some research and give it a try.

[mtlakejim]

Originally Posted by twindman

I think the key point here is "What is plenty of water?". Perhaps we just each visualize it differently. Like one idea - half a gallon per flush. Or another idea - enough to flush everything down but no more.

Look at it this way. You need at least enough water added that the mix in the tank has the consistency thinner than a milk shake. The only thing taking the solids out of the tank is gravity and water. Even using plenty of water there will be some "stuff" left behind.

That is why a lot of us, at least occasionally, run a spinning nozzle wand down the toilet. If your full time, maybe once every other month. If only a weekender, maybe once or twice a year.

If you have full hookups and a black tank flush setup (spinning nozzle inside the tank), run the flush while dumping every time plus about 15 minutes after. I usually at least partially refill the tank with the flush setup and dump again every third time. IF the fluids are really nasty on the second fill I will do it again. If it is not full hookup at the park you can always leave some water in your fresh water tank and setup the onboard 12volt pump to pump thru the black tank flush system (with a check valve of course and separate hose off of the outside shower nozzle).

I know this sounds nasty but, one good way to make sure your getting the job done is to have a clear section of pipe on the end of your black tank hose so you can see what the fluids look like that are dumping. They sell those at RV stores.

Its all about making sure that you work those solids out of the tank so they don't eventually build up into something that won't dissolve and flow out. It really doesn't matter much what kind of toliet paper you use as it isn't the only solid in the tank. But it does matter a bit how much paper you use. Don't get carried away and for sure nothing other than paper and poo (you don't want anything that won't break down and will block the tank outlet. A little common sense goes a long way.....