Interior Water Pipes and Subzero Temps - Montana Owners Club

TYR · 01-01-2014, 04:28 AM

Friday's overnight low is forecast to be around -4.

Here's what I'm thinking regards to possible freezing of interior water pipes.

1) Turn off shore water connection so water is not coming into the rig/pipes. (We're currently static and water hose is hooked up all the time. It's heat tape wrapped and insulated.)
2) Open faucets and drain 'em prior to turning in for the night.
3) Leave cabinets open so heat inside rig gets to the pipes.
4) Don't turn on water pump until next morning.

We've had a week single digits as highs before with no issues; however, we've never experienced subzero temps. By doing the above, there would be minimal water in 'em in case they do freeze.

Maybe this is overkill, but it can't do any harm, right? Right?

Betty

Alwims · 01-01-2014, 04:47 AM

We've not experience below freezing yet in our adventures. 4 degrees is as low as we've seen so far, but it sounds like you've got a handle on things. The only suggestion I would make is to unhook your water hose and store it in your basement along with adding extra heat in there.

Just wanted to add, we've discovered, there ain't no such thing as overkill in freezing temps.

TYR · 01-01-2014, 04:51 AM

Thanks, Alwims. I edited my original post to note that we're currently static working in NJ. Our water hose is hooked up all the time but is heat taped and insulated. Yep, I agree about no overkill when it comes to cold temps.

Alwims · 01-01-2014, 05:05 AM

I just want to add, I read in your other post that skirting doesn't work for you guys and I want to tell you, I am amazed at how well you have handled the cold without it. We started using vinyl skirting this year and can't believe the difference in how warm things are in here, even in low single digits. We are able to keep it a toasty 72 degrees and 68 at night without using near as much propane as we have in previous years. I bow my hat to you guys.

mhs4771 · 01-01-2014, 05:39 AM

Betty, how about also opening the Low Drain valves to drain as much standing water as possible out of the pipes?

jimcol · 01-01-2014, 05:46 AM

If you are hooked up to sewer I'd just let a faucet run a steady small stream all night of mixed hot and cold. One faucet in the front of the rig and another in the rear of the rig. It doesn't take much water movement to keep the pipes/hose/water heater from freezing. Jim

TYR · 01-01-2014, 05:54 AM

Hey, Michelle and Ann - how are ya? We met at the 2011 rally in Lancaster. We could do that, too. Thanks for the reminder!

jimcol - We saw others do that during a Winter in MO. Not a good thing, IMHO. Folks had freeze-up right up the sewer line into the rig. Not pretty. We never leave our grays (or black, of course) open. If you drip a faucet w/o leaving a tank open, then there's the possibility of overflow. Saw that happen, too. I know a lot of folks leave the gray open, but these are risks we don't want to take. To each their own, but thanks for your thoughts.

Mrs. CountryGuy · 01-01-2014, 06:37 AM

We let the water run, BUT NOT AT THOSE TEMPS!!

If we are in a situation where it will dip below freezing for a few hours, maybe 25 at the lowest, we have allowed to drip.

At 4 below, I would not be comfy doing that either. It can freeze in the discharge pipes.

There are members that have withstood longer time frames at much colder temps, I don't know if they are monitoring the forum at this time. I am fairly sure they do not shut off the water and drain the lines. They have been in 10 and 20 and 30 and 40 below for days, and maybe even longer than a week at time. Cannot do without water that long. As far as I know they have all been skirted in some manner and run light bulbs and such in the sensitive areas like the control panel in units that have those.

All that said, do what you feel you must to protect your unit. Period!

halfwright · 01-01-2014, 06:41 AM

That sounds like a pleasant job, if not for the weather. Do you have to walk the place or just gate control? Is it 24/7?

TYR · 01-01-2014, 07:29 AM

Jim and Darlene,

We did a 2-month relief gig with this same security company in 2010 and enjoyed it. The duties were more basic . . . night-shift patrols of a dormant industrial site. In February 2011, we were offered this position and coming on board with the security company long-term.

Our initial contract commitment for this assignment was one year. That's not for everyone. It can be rather isolative at times, and that's not for everyone either. DH and I are together virtually 24/7, excepting our various interests, running errands, etc. We are lucky to have an office trailer to give us more room. We also purchased a washer and dryer, which the company allowed us to install in the office trailer.

We have this property, another mill down the road about a mile and an empty farmhouse down from that which we check; Dave does a walk-thru of each weekly. A company truck is provided for patrols. There's a dam on this property; a dam check is done weekly. We escort non-company visitors as required, make sure everyone signs in/out (utility folks, etc.), perform groundskeeping (mainly mowing seasonally), and miscellaneous other duties as asked - nothing really taxing with regards to physical labor (no digging ditches, etc.) There are alarm systems and cameras at both mills; if an alarm goes off at 2 AM, we have to respond. When not actually performing duties, our time is our own for hobbies, etc. I have flowerbeds and plant a wee garden every year.

We work closely with local law enforcement, and they are great folks. I really can't say enough good things about the local cops. I joined the local CERT (Community Emergency Response Team) group, a volunteer first responder organization. In fact, our training drill last year was held here at the mill. What a hoot!

We are provided utilities and Internet by the contracting company along with our wages.

I also work part-time as a virtual assistant and taught AHA CPR the past couple of years.

It's essentially a 24/7 job, but that doesn't mean we are stuck here. One of us is here in the office during regular business hours; Dave can go for a bike ride or I can run errands, but one of us is on duty. Some days are dead quiet and others are hopping. Evenings and weekends we both can leave the property to dine out, etc. but . . . calls to the property and the alarms go to my cell phone and we respond if needed. Doesn't happen that often, especially since we've been here a while and it's known there is a presence on the property. We are not confrontational and do not carry firearms. Hence, we work closely with local LEO.

We are contract, so we can take off whenever we want. Took a holiday to the beach last year and the Montana rally in 2011. The company we are contracted to is . . . remarkable. They treat us very well but, again, they know we do our jobs and are reliable. We've also stuck it out here through 2 hurricanes, a couple of Nor'easter storms, and Superstorm Sandy. I was diagnosed with cancer for a 2nd time last year and underwent two major surgeries here. The company was so very supportive and the healthcare was excellent, even though it's a relatively small community.

I miss traveling, yes. This was not the original plan of following the seasons; however, we have a bit of job security, the pay is consistent and better than campground jobs, our environment - while harsh at times - rewards us with quiet and beauty, we aren't stressed or micro-managed and our employer companies (the security company and the contracting company) are great. If we wanted to leave here, the security company would work with us and other teams to do a swap or find us another spot.

I've got the best of both worlds. Living in my RV, able to say adios if we want, yet a steady income with work I dig. I've done the corporate scene and other things, and this beats it by miles and miles.

If you or any of ya'll Montana folks out there are ever in the neighborhood and need a place to boondock for a night or two, we have a big parking lot!

Life is good!

Icehouse · 01-01-2014, 07:35 AM

We just came out of a week of -20 temps and did fine. Hose (insulated and heat taped) remained hooked up and on, no draining of lines, all cabinets shut, etc. We NEVER leave a faucet running and the sewer open.

Bigboomer · 01-01-2014, 09:26 AM

Betty,

We have already been down below zero this winter and have had no issues. If you can keep the basement area warm with a small ceramic heater and keep the furnace running there should be no issues. As stated Mrs. Countryguy noted running the water will freeze up in the drain pipe. Make sure your hose thermostat is exposed to the cold so it will stay on.
Also we keep all the cabinet doors open so the heat gets into them and keeps the area warm.
Just in case you have any issues and need help send me a PM and we can come down to help with whatever comes up.

Stay warm,

Les

JandC · 01-02-2014, 01:36 AM

When we experienced zero temps prior to heading south this year I left the water run a couple times. I left it on just slightly more than a drip but it was the warm water. My discharge was PVC (not slinky stinky) and it only had to run about 5 feet to the in-ground hole outside. Never observed any evidence of water freezing up in discharge line.

TYR · 01-02-2014, 03:35 AM

Hiya JandC,

We also have PVC for most of the length of the discharge line . . . and it's a bit of a length simply due to logistics of how things are set up here. We do have a bit of heavy-duty sewer hose from the PVC to the rig.

Glad you didn't have issues.

Mrs. CountryGuy · 01-02-2014, 08:12 AM

If I remember correctly, and HAHA, well, anyway - - -

The issue is the sewer hose, with the bumps. That can freeze up, cause of the bumps.

The solid PVC has fewer obstructions to make trouble.

Continued best wishes for those fussing with Momma Nature.

Wayne and Carolyn Mathews · 01-02-2014, 04:52 PM

Like Icehouse, we just went through a 10-day period of -20 to -30 degrees at night and sub-zero temps also during the day. We are skirted and have the waterline wrapped with heat tape. Never had a problem with the water freezing, although we did put a light in the convenience center after the water was a little slow coming to life one day. The refrigerator quit working after 3 days of those temperatures, but once the temperature started hitting 32+ during the day, the refrigerator started working again.

Several years ago, we lived for a year in our trailer on our land while we built our home (in Montana), and several times the temperature hit -45 to -50. We were skirted and had heat lamps under the rig. Because we didn't have an accessible well, we had to bring water in to fill the fresh water tank. I think the water in the trailer froze once or twice for less than 3 hours. (We did have to use Porta-Potties, which we had behind the rig, because obviously without a way to clean the black tank, we couldn't use it.)

Carolyn

Bigboomer · 01-03-2014, 02:19 AM

Betty, checking in to see how you have faired so far with the storm here?

TYR · 01-03-2014, 06:52 AM

Les,

We made it through just fine. Left well enough alone re: water pipe situation and we're good. Woke up to 8" of snow on the ground this morning. Sun is shining, it's not as cold as forecast today (so far) and there is a bit of snow blowing around but it's not bad.

Now if I can just get the snow out of the bed of my truck so I can go somewhere without blowing snow all over people, I'll be just ducky! Ha!

Thanks for checking. Hope you guys are safe and cozy!

Betty

Bigboomer · 01-03-2014, 07:53 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by TxYellowRose

Les,

We made it through just fine. Left well enough alone re: water pipe situation and we're good. Woke up to 8" of snow on the ground this morning. Sun is shining, it's not as cold as forecast today (so far) and there is a bit of snow blowing around but it's not bad.

Now if I can just get the snow out of the bed of my truck so I can go somewhere without blowing snow all over people, I'll be just ducky! Ha!

Good to hear! We had about 12" on the ground as of 5 am and it was about 5 below at that time. Biggest thing was the drifts which were about 4 feet around the cars.

Guess it is going to be one of those winters around here! Glad we are 15 minutes from the ski resorts and snow mobile trails!

Stay warm in NJ!

Les

Thanks for checking. Hope you guys are safe and cozy!

Betty

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