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Old 04-27-2011, 02:20 AM   #1
TheJeep
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Towing Problem or Normal Towing???

I have two questions when it comes to towing my Montana. I am new to towing, we had a Motorhome and towed a Jeep before upgrading to the Montana. Our TV is a Dodge 3500 Dully with 410s. The Montana is a 3455SA. So 2 things that I have noticed is that sometimes at highway speeds (55-60) I have noticed that the truck feels like it is bucking. Maybe better described as chugging. Is this normal? I thought it could be the wind hitting the front of the Montana. Second problem is when I am stopped the trailer brakes take about ½ a second to a second longer to release than the truck brakes. I thought they should release at the same time. Is that a problem with the truck or the trailer?
We had our first trip with it last weekend and had a great time. Any guidance on the problems that I have notice would be very helpful.

Thanks
 
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Old 04-27-2011, 02:57 AM   #2
pbahlin
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I have the same truck, pulling a Big Sky. Mine will 'chuck' at times but it is only when I'm on a bad surface. A road with concrete expansion joints (even when covered with asphalt) is usually the culprit.

I have a Moryde shock absorbing pin which helps a lot and I also have a Trailer Saver air ride hitch.

Regarding the brakes issue, I've never noticed a delay on release. I do notice a bit of delay if I'm stopped. When I actuate the trailer brakes for a tug test I notice that the rig will move a little before the brakes really lock up. I always assumed this was just due to the slack being wrung out of the system. The brakes are magnetically actuated but rely on mechanical linkage to apply the real force. The magnets just get things going.

Update: Just thought of another thing regarding chucking. I can also get some bouncing when starting of from a dead stop (usually on a hill) if I apply too much power. The Cummins has enough torque to get the rear wheels bouncing up and down. If this is happening I just back off a bit.
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Old 04-27-2011, 03:09 AM   #3
richfaa
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As to the chucking...It is normal...but not something you want. Could be many things... Soft suspension on the truck, Truck and camper not properly set up. To much pin weight. The Mor Ryde or similar pin boxes will eliminate most of it.

Never noted the brake issue.

The Mor Ryde pin box or similar will help a lot. We added the Mor Ryde IS system..that also helped.. We just added air bags and what a difference as we can now keep the truck perfectly level
On on trip back up from Florida we were solid as a rock and a smooth ride. We were surprised at how much the air bags helped although others on this forum..told me so. Our truck and camper are within a inch of perfectly level front to back. IMO the proper set up is very important.....and expensive...

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Old 04-27-2011, 04:24 AM   #4
TheJeep
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I was thinking and maybe a better way to describe the chugging is it feels like one cylinder is not firing. It just feels like that, the engine is funning fine.

We do have the Mor Ryde pin box and have a Pullrite super fifth hitch. We are about 4 inches higher in the front. I can’t lower it b/c the pin box will hit the sides of the bed on a tight turn.

I don’t think it is over weight, I plan on weighing it soon. I did not notice the chugging in the past so maybe it was just the road/weather that day.

The brakes are controlled by the built in controller in the truck so if they are slow to release it could be a problem with that???? The trailer brakes are electric so without current being sent to them they should release instantly????
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Old 04-27-2011, 05:56 AM   #5
pineranch
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Make sure the superglide is adjusted properly. The threaded stop may require adjustment (big nut on rear).
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Old 04-27-2011, 08:28 AM   #6
kramperD
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Richfaa......which airbags did you install to help your ride and did you do it yourself? Still too new to know if it would help me out or not. Thanks, D
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Old 04-27-2011, 08:32 AM   #7
sreigle
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We had that brake problem on our first Montana. At first, it seemed like when I was stopped, then hit the gas, the Montana brakes would take a second or so to release. Eventually they wouldn't release at all until I dragged the Montana a few feet forward. Then they'd release.

We were still under warranty. The brakes apply by being forced outward on a cam on which they swivel. This cam is not round. It's square or rectangular, diamond shaped I guess. Anyhow, the dealer found the linings so worn the shoes were forced out so far that the cam had to go past it's high point. Thus the springs could not pull the shoes past that high point to retract them.

It is really hard to explain so I'm not sure that makes any sense. The bottom line is the linings were worn down so far that the brakes could not release on their own. The dealer found we had only one brake functioning and that's why it wore so badly. The other three looked brand new.

Your problem may be different but I thought I'd throw this out for consideration. The Montana was less than a year old at that time and we were not fulltiming but weekenders and vacationers and still working so not traveling a lot.
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Old 04-27-2011, 09:43 AM   #8
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As for the brake issue ... I have a Prodigy. When I set the brakes a little on the agressive side I do have a little tug when I let off the brake pedal, but only at low speeds. If I back the controller down a bit ... it goes away. My brakes a near brand new.
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Old 04-27-2011, 11:18 AM   #9
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quote:Originally posted by ddettorre

Richfaa......which airbags did you install to help your ride and did you do it yourself? Still too new to know if it would help me out or not. Thanks, D
Did the "air lift bags".. Could not do it myself.My truck was within all ratings and spec's with plenty of CC..But the pin weight of the 3400 dropped the rear by 2 1/2 inches which translated to over 4 inches at the front. That took weight off the front axle which also contributed to my front tires wearing on the outside. We are now perfectly level and there is a big difference.
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Old 04-27-2011, 01:02 PM   #10
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ditto dieselguy, when my brake controller is set too high, it creates a harsh stop and go and does feel like its tugging before release. Ease the brake controller some, a good way to check is to roll at low speed (idle) and activate the brake from the controller only (no truck brake). It should roll to a smooth stop and not lock up or buck if set properly. That's how I was taught where to keep the controller. Hope that helps. Good luck.
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Old 04-28-2011, 02:32 AM   #11
TheJeep
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Thanks for the replies everyone. I also talked to the service guy at the RV dealership. He said first thing to try would be turning down the brake controller. I had it set for 5.5, and he suggested trying 4.5. I could feel the trailer brakes coming on and he said that I should not feel them come on or feel like the trailer is pushing the truck. He also said that my other problem maybe normal or it could be a lot of other things. He wants me to bring it over to the dealership for a test drive to try and determine the problem.
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Old 04-28-2011, 06:29 AM   #12
thor
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the clugging could be the lockup converter going from lock to unlock mode. it is right at that speed that the converter locks up depending on how hard it is pulling .nothing you can do that is when it locks up.so it is normal.if you put it in tow haul mode this will stop that.thats if that is what it is.
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Old 04-28-2011, 10:01 AM   #13
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'TheJeep' -- first thing -- has your Dodge been checked for the Dodge recall. The brake condition you describe is what the, of all things' power steering recall fixes. As the brake booster on our Dodges is Hydrostatic -- the power steering pump provides the umph to do the job. For whatever reason, the cap on the power steering pump created too much pressure and the brakes for the trailer do not release properly. The cap that they put on is a little bit shorter inside and fixed the problem for several of us (I have electric over Hydraulic so I have a different issue) but on the all electric brakes it fixed that problem for several of us.

As for the chucking, I notice it much more on my 2010 crew cab. That little extra wheel base over what an extended cab (or the old model 'crew cab' had) seems to make a big difference. I don't know if it is that the tires on the truck hit a concrete seem at the same time now or what but the 'chucking' is very noticable. Took my old truck, a good friend of mine bought it) on the same road a couple of weeks ago with my trailer and it was a much smoother ride -- The past truck is a 2008 DRW 4x4 'short crewcab' with 8 ft bed; my 2010 is a DRW, 4x4 with new length crewcab and 8 ft bed. I can live with it (I hope) but the wife has not ridden in the truck when towing so I'm not sure she will handle it.
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Old 04-28-2011, 01:53 PM   #14
TheJeep
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Skypilot...I had that recall done about a month ago. That recall has been in the back of my head wondering if the new cap fixed it or even if they changed it.
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Old 04-29-2011, 02:06 AM   #15
Phil P
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Hi

Sreigle has an exultant description of how the brakes work.

As the brakes wear the time between the application of the TV brakes and the application of the trailer brakes gets longer. Excessive ware will cause the electric brakes to “lock” and not release. You can release them by applying you hand control and backing up about 6 inches.

Sreigle’s description of the problem involving not all brakes working properly is the second one I have read on this forum.

Here is a picture of an electric trailer brake with self-adjuster



This is a right side break

The oval part at the bottom is the magnet. The cable to the right is the works the self-adjuster.

Not all electric brakes have self-adjusters; if you have self adjusters it would be unlikely to have the brakes "lock" because of wear.

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Old 04-29-2011, 04:05 AM   #16
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by TheJeep

We are about 4 inches higher in the front. I can’t lower it b/c the pin box will hit the sides of the bed on a tight turn.
This is your main problem IMHO. I traveled with my Montana about one maybe two inches higher in the front. I thought it was level but it wasn't. We had so much "chunking" going down a concrete highway we were getting motion sick. I lowered the hitch down to the next hole and the ride was much better.
But like you say the pin box will hit the bed sides if you lower id down more. If I remember correctly you need four to five inches of clearance between the camper and bed. I noticed the new truck beds are much deeper than the older Dodge beds like my truck. I wondered if anybody would have troubles. Plus even the 2wd ones set so much higher in the rear. The only thing that I can think of is to have your axles "flipped". That is to put the axles under the springs instead of on top. That would lift the trailer higher. BUT that only works IF your Monty has leaf springs under it.
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Old 04-30-2011, 09:22 AM   #17
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I had the brake problem you mention for over a year. However, we just came back from Texas after a 2 month stay during which we had the recall done which changed out the fluid cap. The trailer brakes hanging in for a couple of extra seconds is gone. Maybe yours is too. We run our Dodge brake controller at 6. Above that results in slow speed grabbing, and below not enough drag at high speed. Good luck.
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Old 04-30-2011, 01:38 PM   #18
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I think this is common to the truck cause mine does the same thing. I came across a cement bridge on I-95 somewhere in Virginia and we did lots of chucking, to the point that I put the brakes on to stop it, I think its because of the wheel base is so long.

Also my brakes on the camper seem to take a second or 2 to release after I start to accelerate too, and I have had the cap replaced already and have my brake controller set at 5.

Oh, did you get your CDL?
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Old 04-30-2011, 02:26 PM   #19
sreigle
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Tom, if you are where you can do it you might try jacking up one wheel so it's off the ground, the pull the cord out of the emergency brake module on the pinbox. Check to make sure the brake locked up. Then jack up another wheel and test that. Etc. I mention this because when I had that problem with our first Montana the cause was an excessively worn brake due to it being the only brake working.. doing all the stopping. This might not be your problem but it is a possibility.
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Old 05-01-2011, 06:23 AM   #20
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Hi Steve,

I did test my brakes in the snow, making a left turn and pushing on the slide control for the brake controller. Saw the 2 wheels lock up in the snow. DW said she saw the same thing when doing a right turn, so I know they at least work.

I have read over in the Cummins forum that lots of folks complain about the brake controllers in the Dodges.
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