Dead Battery - Montana Owners Club

DONnANNIE · 08-27-2009, 07:12 PM

The other day I went to our storage area to bring the 5er home so I could clean it up. When I tried to raise the front landing gear there was no movement. The battery was dead. It had only been in the storage facility about one month. I plugged in the umbilical cord to the truck and raised the landing gear - hooked up - and brought her home.

Once I got home, I checked the battery with a meter and it read 11.5 volts. I plugged in the power cable to start charging the battery. In the mean time I checked for anything left running. I couldn't find any 12 volts items left on, no lights, fans or the antenna amplifier. I checked around and could hear what I thought was a fan. The sound was coming from the hot water heater. I checked and found that I left the electric toggle switch on in the HWH. The sound I was hearing was the Hot Water element heating up the water in the HW tank. I turned the switch off and the sound stopped.

My question is: With the switch left on and no shore power available(as with the storage facility), is there a drain on the battery from the HWH? Should I use the Battery Disconnect Switch now that I have no shore power at the storage facility?

Art-n-Marge · 08-27-2009, 08:16 PM

The hot water heater electronics run on 12v therefore it would cause a drain on the battery if left on. This is also true if you run the refrigerator on propane and leave it on and even the furnace runs on 12v too so make sure the thermostat control is off.

When storing for a long time if any device that uses 12v is left on it will drain the batteries if you do not disconnect the batteries. Since 110v is only provided by your converter, when it's not connected to shore power or a generator there is no drain on anything even if a 110v device is accidently left on.

On edit: To answer your questions ff equipped it would be a good idea to disconnect your battery just in case something that uses 12v is accidently left on.

I hope this explains things adequately.

dsprik · 08-28-2009, 02:17 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by Art-n-Marge

The hot water heater electronics run on 12v therefore it would cause a drain on the battery if left on. This is also true if you run the refrigerator on propane and leave it on and even the furnace runs on 12v too so make sure the thermostat control is off.

Just found this out a while ago. Those three appliances require 12v and will draw from the battery as Art says - even with 110 AC shut off.

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by Art-n-Marge

On edit: To answer your questions ff equipped it would be a good idea to disconnect your battery just in case something that uses 12v is accidently left on.

Your 2007 is equipped with that red shutoff key in the convenience center. Also, conversely: as these appliances will draw from your battery if turned on, they also will NOT operate if you try to run them off straight 110 AC with the battery turned off or disconnected. That's my new understanding, anyway...

Mrs. CountryGuy · 08-28-2009, 02:46 AM

Don't forget the flashlight and the CO2 detectors MAY draw from your battery. Ours do, later or different models may have different set ups for charging/running those items, check yours (that is the infamous disclaimer for different years of Tanas!)

When we take Tana off the power grid, we turn off her battery via shut off switch.

ARJ · 08-28-2009, 03:00 AM

Propane detector?

bncinwv · 08-28-2009, 03:19 AM

The battery disconnect switch is the answer. We use it when the rig sits for extended times and it will preserve the charge. The front jacks (do) and the slides (??), I believe remain operational with the battery disconnect engaged, but all other 12V drains, including the various detectors, are in the disconnect cycle. Dave is correct, if the disconnect is engaged, the HWH, the Fridge and the heater will not operate. Our pets discovered this fact on the way to Florida last Thanksgiving, when dear(dummy??) old Dad forgot to turn the disconnect back off. The heater will not work!! Thank goodness for fur coats!!
Bingo

DONnANNIE · 08-28-2009, 06:02 PM

That's what I thought.

Thanks for all of the responses.

Waynem · 08-29-2009, 03:55 AM

With that low a voltage the batteries may be sulfonated. Take a look at Battery Minder and see if this would be for you.

sreigle · 08-29-2009, 07:20 AM

True, the appliance electronics require 12v but the w/h heating element itself is 110v so that wasn't running during storage. My understanding is if the fridge is turned off, the water heater electric and propane elements are turned off, then neither are drawing 12v. That's just my understanding and could be wrong. However, the propane detector does draw 12v (and no off switch) and that's usually what runs down a battery over time when not connected to shore power. I agree with Bingo about using a battery disconnect switch. Or just disconnect the battery cables.

DONnANNIE · 08-29-2009, 06:42 PM

I had the battery on charge via the shore power for two days. When I disconnected shore power I checked the battery voltage and it was 13.2 vdc. Also, I have the IOTA Smart Charger. I can only have the 5er here at the house for 48hrs, so that's why I disconnected and moved back to storage. I also used the Disconnect Switch.

I'll check the voltage on next Wednesday when I bring it back home prior to our Labor Day weekend outing.

Thanks for all of the good info.

DONnANNIE · 09-02-2009, 07:39 PM

Follow up.
As I said in my last post, after two days of charging, I had to take it off the shore power and move to storage. At that time I checked the battery and it was 13.2 volts. I used the battery to extend the front landing gear and then I turned the "Battery Disconnect" switch off.

Today, Wednesday, we went to the storage area and extended the landing gear so we could hookup the TV. The battery was still disconnected. Once we got home, we extended the landing gear again so we could unhook the TV. The battery was still disconnected. I checked the battery and it read 12.93 volts. So, it looks like the HWH electric switch being left on was the source of my dead battery.

MuddyPaws · 09-03-2009, 06:27 PM

After our 2955 caught fire from a short in the 12v system I became a firm believer in battery cutoff switches.

It was a very expensive lesson. The final tally was over $22,000.

It's highly recommended that you install a switch in such a way that everything, landing legs included, does not get voltage when the switch is open. Also, put the switch on the ground, i.e. negative side of the batteries. Less chance of throwing a short that way.

Regards,
Russ, AKA Muddypaws

DONnANNIE · 09-03-2009, 07:17 PM

Quote:

quote:MuddyPaws Posted - Sep 04 2009 : 12:27:06 AM
After our 2955 caught fire from a short in the 12v system I became a firm believer in battery cutoff switches. It was a very expensive lesson. The final tally was over $22,000.

It's highly recommended that you install a switch in such a way that everything, landing legs included, does not get voltage when the switch is open. Also, put the switch on the ground, i.e. negative side of the batteries. Less chance of throwing a short that way.

OUCH! ! ! Sorry to hear about your fire. That is a very good idea to put in a separate switch to disconnect the battery from everything.

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