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01-08-2022, 02:31 PM
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#1
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Established Member
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Reno
Posts: 13
M.O.C. #26860
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Brown Out when generator connected
I have a 2021 Montana 3120RL. When I connect to shore power whether 50 or 30 amp service my voltage reading is normal at 115-120. When I connect 15 amp house power I get good voltage readings. When we're dry camping the 3000W inverter shows good readings. I have 2 Honda 2000 generators, if I connect either of them individually I get 65volts and a Brown Out warning. I get the same bad reading if I connect them in parallel, this configuration gets me to 30amps. I borrowed my neighbors 4000W/30amp generator and got the same bad readings with Brown Out. There were no loads on any of the generators when connected. I took my Honda generators to the dealership and they both check 4.0. Anyone else have this problem?
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01-08-2022, 03:23 PM
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#2
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Salem
Posts: 7,665
M.O.C. #2283
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Do you have a transfer switch? If so that is the first place I would look.
I’ll bet these generators are putting out 124 volts. So I would rule out the generators.
Lynwood
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01-08-2022, 03:54 PM
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#3
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Established Member
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Southern Pines
Posts: 17
M.O.C. #29946
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Brown Out on Generator
Are all of the generators, inverter generators (quiet)? Is there an onboard EMS, Surge suppressor? Could be a floating neutral issue.
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01-08-2022, 05:05 PM
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#4
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Montana Master
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Alton
Posts: 2,892
M.O.C. #24086
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For house electrical receptacles,
You get
Ground to hot 120vac
Ground to neutral 0vac
Neutral to hot 120vac.
I measured the same voltage on a 2000w Go Power Inverter that you did.
The hot side of the receptacle read 67vac.
The neutral side of the receptacle read 67vac.
Then I read between the hot and the neutral and got 124vac.
I checked my Champion 4000W inverter generator.
I got the same readings on the 20A receptacle AND the 30A RV receptacle.
BUT plugged into the rig, all the appliances work fine (except for the 1450W Whirlpool microwave).
All they need is the potential difference of 120vac to work.
NOTE: I do NOT have a bonding plug.
A bonding plug connects ground to neutral. You can buy one or make one if you need to have one.
I do not in my case.
I think I know what is going on in your situation, but to be sure,
Measure the receptacle output of the Honda generator.
Check
Ground to hot =
Ground to neutral =
Hot to neutral =
Do the same thing on your parallel kit with the generators connected and running.
An excellent group for RV electrical advice is the Facebook group
RVELECTRICITY.
Mike Sokol is one of the RV industries leading electrical technicians.
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01-08-2022, 07:11 PM
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#5
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Established Member
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Reno
Posts: 13
M.O.C. #26860
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Thanks for your responses! The first thing I checked was ground by truly driving a grounding stake into mother earth and attaching ground wire to gen, no changes. Next was transfer switch and it checked good. Both my Honda gens are inverter generators putting out clean AC. I had the dealership check floating neutral when I took them in and he said they were good. But now I'm suspect after reading Daryles post. His trouble shooting numbers look very familiar. I'll test the gen receptacles myself and the 30 amp parallel output. I hope it's that easy!! Thanks again
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01-08-2022, 07:29 PM
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#6
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Site Team
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Oro Valley
Posts: 4,081
M.O.C. #20477
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I would suspect the dogbone you are using to connect the genny to the 50 amp cord coming into your rig.
__________________
Zack and Donna plus Millie and Ranger
2018 3160RL
"Life is too short to stay indoors, enjoy the ride!"
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01-08-2022, 09:00 PM
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#7
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Site Team
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Carmichael - CA
Posts: 7,686
M.O.C. #4831
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hazex4
....I have 2 Honda 2000 generators, if I connect either of them individually I get 65volts and a Brown Out warning.....
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What is a "Brown Out" warning and where does it come from. I am not familiar with such a thing.
__________________
Carl (n Susan)
There is more to life than fuel mileage.
2012 Montana 3700RL Big Sky Package towed by a 2015 Ford F350 6.7L PSD 4WD CC LWB
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01-10-2022, 11:47 AM
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#9
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Established Member
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Reno
Posts: 13
M.O.C. #26860
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Thanks again Daryles, I'll digest these articles they look spot on!
For Carl, a Brown Out, at least in my scenario is when there's a reduction in standard voltage. I should be reading 115 to 120volts when AC power is connected. When I connect my generator I only get 65v which, of course, is a huge reduction and can cause damage. My display shows a Brown Out msg alerting to the condition. I'm learning all this the hard way!
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01-10-2022, 12:51 PM
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#10
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Site Team
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Carmichael - CA
Posts: 7,686
M.O.C. #4831
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hazex4
.....My display shows a Brown Out msg alerting to the condition....
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Thanks! I think I understand the Brown Out concept it was the message. What device are you using that displays that message? Not something my VOMs do.
__________________
Carl (n Susan)
There is more to life than fuel mileage.
2012 Montana 3700RL Big Sky Package towed by a 2015 Ford F350 6.7L PSD 4WD CC LWB
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01-13-2022, 10:53 AM
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#11
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Established Member
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Reno
Posts: 13
M.O.C. #26860
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The display is from Precision Circuits called a Power Control System Central Monitor Panel (PCS). Works pretty good managing all your power inputs.
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01-13-2022, 11:36 AM
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#12
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Site Team
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Carmichael - CA
Posts: 7,686
M.O.C. #4831
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hazex4
The display is from Precision Circuits called a Power Control System Central Monitor Panel (PCS). Works pretty good managing all your power inputs.
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Thanks! I was unaware of this system. It is something I need to investigate further.
__________________
Carl (n Susan)
There is more to life than fuel mileage.
2012 Montana 3700RL Big Sky Package towed by a 2015 Ford F350 6.7L PSD 4WD CC LWB
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01-13-2022, 03:46 PM
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#13
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Montana Master
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Mena
Posts: 504
M.O.C. #17723
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Haxex4,
Do you have the Legacy and Super Solar upgrades?
The Super Solar is a unique system and has some great upgrades.
The brown-out error is solved by the bonding plug.
Ask me how I know...
Ron
__________________
Ron & Rhonda
2021 3230CK Montana Legacy w/ Super SolarFlex
(old rig) 2015 Montana 3611RL 8K I.S., Disk Brakes, Sailun Tires
2015 F350 XLT Crew Dually 20K B&W Companion
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01-16-2022, 01:43 PM
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#14
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Established Member
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: Richland
Posts: 13
M.O.C. #25383
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I agree it maybe the floating neutral issue. You need to bond the neutral of the generator to generator frame. Check some you tube videos for further information
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01-16-2022, 02:02 PM
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#15
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Montana Master
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Livermore
Posts: 5,182
M.O.C. #1920
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A simple test if it’s the bonded neutral issue (which Ron and I both know about) from experience. Take a plug, run a piece of 12 ga wire between the neutral and ground on the plug and insert into one of the outlets on the generator. You can purchase a bonded neutral plug or make your own. EMS systems find the open neutral and say it’s a fault. Let us know what you find as a solution.
__________________
Ron and Terrie Ames plus Meg - MOC #1920/KF0NTA
2021Montana 3230CK Super Solar+ Legacy Package
2021 Ram 3500 Laramie Longhorn, BIM Charging
4x4, SRW, LB, Crew Cab, Pullrite 3900 Hitch
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01-27-2022, 05:59 AM
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#16
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Northville, NY
Posts: 814
M.O.C. #21158
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daryles
For house electrical receptacles,
You get
Ground to hot 120vac
Ground to neutral 0vac
Neutral to hot 120vac.
I measured the same voltage on a 2000w Go Power Inverter that you did.
The hot side of the receptacle read 67vac.
The neutral side of the receptacle read 67vac.
Then I read between the hot and the neutral and got 124vac.
I checked my Champion 4000W inverter generator.
I got the same readings on the 20A receptacle AND the 30A RV receptacle.
BUT plugged into the rig, all the appliances work fine (except for the 1450W Whirlpool microwave).
All they need is the potential difference of 120vac to work.
NOTE: I do NOT have a bonding plug.
A bonding plug connects ground to neutral. You can buy one or make one if you need to have one.
I do not in my case.
I think I know what is going on in your situation, but to be sure,
Measure the receptacle output of the Honda generator.
Check
Ground to hot =
Ground to neutral =
Hot to neutral =
Do the same thing on your parallel kit with the generators connected and running.
An excellent group for RV electrical advice is the Facebook group
RVELECTRICITY.
Mike Sokol is one of the RV industries leading electrical technicians.
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Your 4000W gen should run a microwave. I had the same issue with my Champion 3400. All worked fine but the microwave overloaded it. Connected my EMS and it showed an open ground. Made a G-N plug and the problem went away.
__________________
Jim B
2017 Lariat F-350 FX4, CC, SB, 6.7 PSD 4WD
2018 MONTY 3731FL, at our private winter site in GA
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01-27-2022, 06:34 AM
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#17
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Salem
Posts: 7,665
M.O.C. #2283
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DebNJim B
Your 4000W gen should run a microwave. I had the same issue with my Champion 3400. All worked fine but the microwave overloaded it. Connected my EMS and it showed an open ground. Made a G-N plug and the problem went away.
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Let me make sure I have this right. To make a G N plug you get a male plug and connect the ground to the neutral connector. And that is it.
Lynwood
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01-27-2022, 08:56 AM
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#18
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Established Member
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Southern Pines
Posts: 17
M.O.C. #29946
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Good Article
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01-27-2022, 10:42 AM
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#19
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Seasoned Camper
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Winona Lake
Posts: 81
M.O.C. #24885
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